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Post by Frank Creed on Mar 27, 2008 1:16:22 GMT -5
Why is there so little Christian/ Biblical fantasy for adults? Authors of children and young adult fantasy rule this genre as far as sales go: Donita Paul, Bryan Davis, etc.
Is there not a market for adult fantasy? are there so few novelists writing for this market that they are overlooked? What's the deal?
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cyn
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Post by cyn on Mar 27, 2008 8:13:43 GMT -5
Good question.
There are those who will say: oh, adults read Eric Wilson and Bryan Davis and Narnia. Sure, I can enjoy these books too. But, I want real adult fiction, something with a higher vocabulary and concepts that children don't understand; something to sink my teeth into.
There are the books by Sharon Hinck and Karen Hancock . . . can anyone think of more? Although these books were okay, they just didn't go deep enough for me.
Now, Caprice Hokstad's fantasy series does provide "adult" entertainment. No, not that kind! These novels are written for adult readers. However, Hokstad isn't a ECPA author, and one does wonder if she would have been able to get away with a lot of the plot if she had been published by their rigid standards. I don't believe they would have allowed it. What a shame.
c.
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Post by Caprice on Apr 1, 2008 0:52:05 GMT -5
Well, all the ECPA publishers I submitted to rejected it, which was everyone in the book who said they entertained unagented submissions. I guess that answers the question of whether they would have allowed it.
But truth is, the ECPA pubs were NOT my first choice at all. If I had had my druthers, I would have been published by a genre publisher like Tor. Tolkien and Lewis don't need the ECPA, and I felt like my work was much more like theirs than say, Davis or Paul. But when all one's first choices reject, and then the second and third, and forty-third, well, pretty soon one is scraping the bottom of the wish-barrel and eventually going outside it altogether.
Self-publishing is totally and completely the last resort. I only recommend it when the only alternative is throwing a ms in a drawer to rot. Call me egotistical, but I thought at the time that my story deserved better than that.
As for where the Adult Fantasy is... Geralyn Beauchamp, as I understand it, has a traditional contract for her second book in the Time Masters series. Not sure if she puts herself in fantasy though. It's time travel, so there are some sci-fi aspects, but also some historical elements that feel like fantasy (17th century Scotsman for a hero, mention of the Faire Folk, etc). Another up-and-comer is Bill McGrath with his Sword of Fire trilogy. I hear it's especially male-oriented, which is why I haven't read it, but I think we need more good reading material for men, so I say, "Go Bill!"
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cyn
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Post by cyn on Apr 16, 2008 3:46:16 GMT -5
I guess it is the same old, getting word to would-be readers. Perhaps a multi-author publicity campaign as occurred last year with the Fantasy Four tour of Sharon Hinck, Christopher Hopper, Bryan Davis and Wayne Thomas Batson -- 4 different publishers.
The tour brought much attention to the young adult market for fantasy. Maybe a similar effort from adult fiction novelists?
How about a Caprice Hokstad, ________ (fantasy) Frank Creed (whose Book 2 of the Underground is written for adults), Karina Fabian (sci-fi) tour? The F4 group did their tour on a shoestring budget. Publishers kicked in some gas money, they drove from location to location in a van, and slept at the homes of friends, family and colleagues.
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Post by Deb Kinnard on Apr 16, 2008 7:59:56 GMT -5
Well, I'm hoping my mild-mannered time-travel (fantasy per se, but not a kid's piece) will sell. I'm happy to have an agent sending it out now. There are publishers, of course, that we already know will not give it a chance, so we're concentrating on those who might.
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cyn
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Post by cyn on Apr 16, 2008 15:35:43 GMT -5
You know, "mild-mannered time travel" might have a fighting chance within the big ECPA houses.
These publishers aren't my personal favorites, but one can't ignore the built-in publicity they have for authors.
I don't mean that they will go out of the way to market your book, but that they have a relatively big audience who are willing to read any book published by them, i.e. it's Thomas Nelson et al, the book must be safe for me to read.
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Post by Deb Kinnard on Apr 17, 2008 21:38:41 GMT -5
That's very true, Cyn. My agent tells me this book will be a very hard sell in the Christian market (I have sworn off using CBA as a euphemism for Christian publishing, for life). But I hope some acquisitions editor will come back, say, from lunch where s/he eats a spicy meatball sandwich and onion rings, and feels charitable toward something a bit out of the box.
When, on occasion, the Christian markets have taken a chance, many of these books have a good track record of selling well. Most fantasy is, of course, aimed at young people, but adults & children both liked Donita Paul's dragon series. I believe there's far more room for non-kids' fantasy than has previously been thought.
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Post by Caprice on Apr 18, 2008 23:16:29 GMT -5
Maybe you should try the Neo-Un-Christian publisher, Zondervan?
I'm sure your agent knows a LOT more than I do. I'm just being snarky.
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Post by Frank Creed on Apr 19, 2008 17:20:25 GMT -5
. . . or the un-Christian Thomas Nelson!
Caprice, sometimes snarky gets the information where it needs to go! At least I hope so since it is my favoured mode of providing news.
c
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Post by Deb Kinnard on Apr 19, 2008 20:01:01 GMT -5
So far, I know my agent is planning to send it anywhere she thinks will give it a chance. Though it's a romance at bottom, it looks as though Steeple Hill will not be interested in seeing it. This was something I anticipated, so it doesn't bother me.
I would love to read a time-travel romance that isn't secular-publisher fodder, because in my experience those can be full of ugliness. I suppose I wrote this book because of what I'd like to read, that isn't out there. Such are the things that spur us on!
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Post by Caprice on Apr 19, 2008 23:24:32 GMT -5
Yeah, I had that same faul-- er--motivation. I wish you better luck than I had. A LOT better. You're already closer, since you've got an agent, so chin up.
Thanks Frank, for fixing my bad memory. I get all those big boys mixed up.
Deb, try Geralyn Beauchamp's Time Master series. Sounds exactly like what you're looking for.
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Post by M. C. Pearson on Apr 20, 2008 15:07:21 GMT -5
I've just joined the group here...
I read and write fantasy/spec fiction...but I seem to read mostly secular fantasy because the writing seems so much better.
I'm hoping that is changing...Christian publishers are starting to become more open with taking on fantasy now.
My book is borderline teen/adult...very hard niche since you have to send it as one or the other. I use a larger vocabulary than most teen writers. The thing is, I homeschool. My 12 yr old kid reads at the college level (and has since he was 8). I believe so many publishers have low expectations for kid's intellegence.
Not meaning to tweak anyone's convictions, but I love the Harry Potter series. (Hate the announcement about Dumbledore though...and the fact that it encourages witchcraft.) It is intellegently written, as well as dog-gone fun to read. That is the level I want my writing to be at...it is also the niche I am trying to get into...but with a Christian theme to it.
With my having 'fairies' as my main characters, Christian publishers seem to steer away from it. SIGH. I just believe that God will use my book someday. So, I keep striving to get it published.
(I seek prayers and suggestions about it.)
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Post by Frank Creed on Apr 20, 2008 15:45:39 GMT -5
Not meaning to tweak anyone's convictions, but I love the Harry Potter series. (Hate the announcement about Dumbledore though...and the fact that it encourages witchcraft.) It is intellegently written, as well as dog-gone fun to read. That is the level I want my writing to be at...it is also the niche I am trying to get into...but with a Christian theme to it. Oh, I don't think you'll stir up much in the way of controversy here about HP. I wrote an article at Associated Content about the Christian right's Golden Compass campaign that relates to my take on the issue. As far as the magic/ witchcraft goes, I don't believe that it does to any alarming degree. Adult readers have to read responsibly and parents of children need to monitor their child's reading -- not censor, but stay in touch, encourage kids to question and bring questions to parents, and use the magic-stuff as discussion points. The Dumbledore's outing? Again, though I don't support the lifestyle, I wasn't alarmed by the announcement once viewed in the context Rowling made it. I look at it this way: as Christians we are called upon to love everyone in spite of their sins. I don't believe Rowling would have ever "outed" him except in an extraordinary case: just the right question being asked by the just the right person in just the right situation.
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cyn
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Post by cyn on Apr 20, 2008 21:31:56 GMT -5
Perhaps the CBA/ ECPA publishers will not publish it (but if it qualifies as YA, I think you have a fighting chance), but you could try Christian publishers outside this group or one like Multnomah that has been taken over by larger publisher (ie. Random House).
c.
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Post by M. C. Pearson on Apr 20, 2008 21:45:56 GMT -5
Yes, I'll have to try the smaller publishers. AMG Publishing had it for over a year...it went to three new products meetings before it was turned down. Getting an agent is tough too...so many aren't interested in representing Teen Fantasy...and most publishers only accept agented material. Catch 22. I'm hoping my book will be a cross-over book...that will appeal to all fantasy readers. I've had Jewish, Mormon, and even Wiccan believers comment that they would love to read my book...because it has fairies. When I tell them that it has a Christian theme, they say, "So what! I love fairies!" So, I may have to try secular publishers if I cannot interest the Christian ones. If you know of any Christian pubs (large or small) that would be interested in a Christian Teen/Adult fantasy with fairies, let me know!
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